Pittsburgh -- what's the word here?

HMMMMMMMMMMM what does silence mean...I wonder...

I have heard the same rumors. As of 2 years ago, they were a top-15 program and had more money than they knew how to spend. It sounds like both the money and a few big faculty have disappeared in the past year. I think the division chiefs for both hand and joints were casualties.

All I know is people (attg) are fleeing that program like crazy. I know PA has a lot of malpractice insurance issues, but the attendings at critical positions is killing that place.

alot of it is $$$ issues. word is research took a big hit as far as funding. Has to do with the Dean, not Ortho....but is affecting the ortho research funding a great deal. This is from a research faculty member who recently left. i guess clinical faculty are leaving for similar ($) reasons. I guess it's tough in pittsburgh for some reason???

if you are interested in the city of pittsburgh and not just u of pitt, make sure you check out agh....i know at least one huge name from univ of pitt is now awaiting to start practicing at agh........its a great community program but also has great academics........emphasis is definitely on clinical experience but there are plenty of opportunites to do research there if that is what you are interested in.............agh is definitely moving in the right direction

I totally agree with the gjp25. AGH is a great program, both clinically and academically. Residents operate from day 1 of pgy2 year, do >2500 cases, never double scrub, are not over burdened with floor scut, and are genuinely happy. The program is very strong in hand, joints and trauma and is often ranked over Pitt by people who want to stay in western Pennsylvania (at least that's what many of them claim).

For all of you who want to know the true scoop on pitt, listen up here. I cannot be identified but let's say that I work there and know the inner workings well, but am in a sensitive situation that requires anonymity. The real story is not about malpractice. There have been many faculty who have fled for numerous reasons, most of which have to do with improprieties and unfair resource allocation. The hospital has misplaced nearly 500 million dollars, the best and most talented faculty have left, the chief residents are forced to work perilously as "superchiefs" by night and chiefs by day, which by the way is borderline illegal. So far, 11 faculty have left in the past 2 years, and in January, they lost their best foot and hand faculty. In June, they lost their best trauma (probably their best and most talented surgeon) and joint faculty. They also lost their beloved residency director (and tumor surgeon). Also, a sports guy went to be the ravens doctor in Baltimore. More are planning on leaving. To top it off, there is rumor that another trauma surgeon is leaving as of June 2004, and that a rather unliked faculty attempted a coup and failed. Also rumor that if the chair does not find a new job (purportedly UCSF), he will be fired as will the senior (and least revered) trauma faculty. Since the hospital has lost so much money, they cannot recruit anyone of quality, and the place is in a general state of chaos. Some of the faculty went to AGH, and some of their best surgeons are somewhere nearby, don't know exactly where. A true travesty that it was once in the top 5 and now may go on probation and is probably in the bottom quartile without relief in sight. On the up side, Pittsburgh is a great city. Oh yes, and since the remainder of hospital staff is so miserable, guess who gets the burden of their misery? Well, you may be wondering about the reliability of this info and the source. Suffice it to say, that since I work there and know the "players", you can trust this info and proceed as you will. You have been advised.

in response to the questions about pitt, and mephisto's ridiculous posting here are a few answers. As for pounder's HMM. what does the silence mean, how about we are busy learning and practicing orthopedics at one of the more prestigious academic and clinical ortho institutions in the nation. We don't have time to cruise the internet and chat rooms to search for those who wish to throw stones (will the real mephisto please stand up...Not like we don't know your identity)
I think as future orthopods, we all looked to orthogate at times to find out inside info, but the truth of the matter is as a resident you hardly have the time to be checking all of these postings and reply. We recruit at interview time and on rotations, not on the internet. Be cautious of things you see (especially negative things) from residents about troubles at other programs, they could be doing many more constructive things than slandering others about situations they usually know nothing about. Not to take anything against the residents who are posting messages to be positive and help med students out, but they are in the minority. Mephisto joined just prior to his only posting on orthogate. This forum was meant to help MS out not for propaganda by bitter individuals

As for mephisto, as a resident at Pitt, I can almost guarantee (remember he stressed his anonymity) he doesn't work here... anymore. Not since he resigned because he knew his contract would not be renewed. Do you think if they asked keyshawn about John Gruden and the Bucs he'd have anything nice to say... hardly, after they asked him to leave. See any parallels? As for the finanes of the hospital... did any of you ask for the financial statements of the hospital to the program you were interviewing at, or their spending habits? These are rough financial times for everyone, but I can assure you there are more financial perks here than at the large program I came from or many of the ones I interviewed at. But what pounder heard is right the stipends are no longer what they used to be.

Probation hardly, nice try mephisto- the RRC found no problem but I guess that's not good enough for mephisto.

In such a large program like this one there is always change in faculty. When you hire bright, young attendings to work at a well respected instution, flux is inevitable. Should it be a knock on the program that a young sports attending gets hired to be the chief of sports at a major orthopedic program and the team Dr. for the recent super bowl champs. Has any sports fan ever thought their team was in disarray because their assistant coach left to be a head coach. It means people respect the way you do things.

Pitt is and will remain a top tier program. The academic and clinical experience you get here is outstanding. The residents are great to work with, and the super chief system provides a tremendous learning experience for the junior residents. We work hard, but their is nothing malignant about the place. I think I speak for the residents as a whole when I say that we feel extremely happy that we were able to match at the top of our rank list. The residents aren't unhappy here because this is where we wanted to go. No suprises here.
The best advice I can give any MS3 or below is if you think you are interested in a place rotate there so you can see for yourself. You'll be able to answer all of your own questions.

We apologize for mephisto's tirades, but what can we do? Is it just me or does this remind anyone else of the kid who pouted and took his ball home because he wasn't picked to play in the game

Now who's spouting propaganda? That guy said that Pitt is having financial troubles, which you agreed with. And he said lots of faculty are leaving, which you agreed with. I mean, if you have a problem with what that dude is saying then would you lay off the sports analogies and actually refute what he's saying?!

Pittsanswer brought up that the residents are happy there, so that is new information. The rest of his post was one long rant and absolutely worthless. You come off as being a real jerk, so if you are speaking for the residents at Pitt you did them a huge disservice.

Pittsanswer, take a deeeeep breath, read that dudes post again, and actually write something that is informative. He said the superchief deal is borderline illegal. So can you comment on whether you guys are complying with the new work standards? He said 11 faculty have left in the last 2 years. Is this true? Did the residency director leave? I agree that people being hired away from your program is a compliment, but why do you think they are leaving? Do they see life as better outside Pitt than inside? You can spin it however you want, but if EVERYONE leaves you have one big compliment and one very empty department. I mean, give us something of value. Please.

sorry if prior post came off wrong way, it is unfortunate that due to personality conflict with other faculty someone would try to take it out on the program with negative comments. Two of this years interns were called after match in attempt to persuade them from coming with an apparently similar speech than the post above

Hopefully this will answer some of your questions
That number 11 seems a little high, but ok for arguments sake. The program director did leave and it was unfortunate, but he moved out of state after personal/family issues with the passing of his wife, the move was not career driven. However, one of the senior faculty who had experience in a similar position stepped right in and the we never skipped a beat. For those of you who don't know, the program director is not the same a program chair, it deals more with resident education, rotations, and overall day-to-day resident experience. The prior director was liked by all, and we all feel for him, but it hasn't affected our path as residents. The chairman (Fu) is not leaving and will not be fired. He was offered another chairman position as mentioned but he has officially turned it down and is staying in Pitt.
There was a similar change in faculty approx 6 years prior with the then chair herndon leaving to chair harvard and several faculty leaving with him to be division chiefs. etc. Fu stepped in an the program prospered. It just so happened that several of the attendings hired then are the ones that are in the afforementioned 11. I think 3 left to head their own divisions, the program director is as above, and one of the senior joint surgeons did not leave the program, in a progression to eventual retirement, he became the chief at the VA. Another senior jt. surgeon left I don't know official reason, but it doesn't drastically affect joint experience as we have associate joint faculty in private practice that we have always rotated with as well as the remaining unversity assoc. joint service with the division chief. Other exits appear to be for better financial gains in more private practice type environment (which is not uncommon in surgeons who start out in academic settings) Only a few of those who left went to similar positions in research oriented academic insitutions

What wasn't mentioned was several hires over that period. An outstanding hand surgeon who quickly established himself as on of the most popular faculty members with the resident has been in place. A sports fellow and trauma fellow were also hired to remain after their fellowships. A tumor surgeon from MD anderson will start in March (program director was tumor) and foot and ankle from cleveland clinic will also be coming on. There are also plans to hire a trauma surgeon and expand the existing service
As for 80 hour week. We are well within compliance, and the faculty couldn't be more stringent with their adherence to this. His comment about the superchiefs being illegal, I can't imagine what he is talking about. It is news to me. They are not complaining of any improprieties.

I hope this better answers you questions

Now THAT'S what I'm talking about. Good post dude. Got down to the nuts and bolts and gave us some sweet info. I really appreciate you taking the time to write back in.

Looks to me that Pitt is in a rebuilding period, which can and will happen at every program from time to time. It also looks like they are bringing in some strong new attendings to fill the void. Good rebutal in my opinion.

what's officially happening with the trauma service? Is the prior chief of trauma leaving in addition to another traumatologist? I know trauma is a big service there, right?
Also, what outside hospitals do residents rotate at (and for which services) besides Presby/Montifiore/VA....
thanks.
I did hear that residents are not forced to leave post-call.....i have heard of programs getting 'dinged b/c of that. Any changes in Call schedule???
thanks

Greeting from another resident currently at Pittsburgh. An applicant asked me about this site, and I had to check it out for myself ? I must admit that I was surprised to read the postings and concerns. So let me give you another resident and superchief-to-be perspective.
There have been many changes over the past few years here at Pitt - money is certainly tighter than before, and there has been flux in our faculty. Many have left in hopes of becoming heads of divisions [hand/foot/sports], some for better personal financial arrangements, some for personal reasons, and some have not been invited back. Though that is not odd for there to be turnover at a large program, change can be intimidating for medical students trying to pick a program. So here?s my view ? academic programs can never offer the salary that established physicians can make in the private sector. If someone wants to leave to earn more money, more power to them. What that leaves at your program are attendings who chose to stay because they want to be involved in resident education. If the people who want to stay stay, and the people who want to leave leave, it works out best for the program and residents involved.
All that said, we do have several new attendings that the residents enjoy working with [hand/sports/trauma], new attendings on their way [foot/tumor], and a new residency director from within the program who is very motivated about his position. As for the ones that left, that happens when you are at a top program and the faculty receives offers for other positions. I wish them well -
As far as the superchief year, I am looking forward to it. From my perspective, it is an excellent operative and learning experience, and also an opportunity to teach and educate the junior residents in the wee hours of the evening. It has been around for over 12 years, and everyone that I know that has done it, has been grateful for the experience. I have learned many operative tricks from prior superchiefs and am excited about the upcoming year. Certainly, the more you operate during your training the better -
Lastly, I am very happy I came here, and from what the visiting and Pitt students have told me, they are eager to come here as well. Many of you will have several choices when you decide where to go for your training, and it will be hard to decide. I recommend that you look for a place that will provide you an excellent operative experience, a strong learning environment, and group of residents who like what they do and are happy to be where they are. Pitt satisfies all of that for me.
Hope you all match where you would like -

As far as Chee68 quetions... the head of trauma is not leaving, but we are looking to expand to 4 attendings, and trauma is busy here - but to be honest, nothing is really too busy with the 80 hour work week. Presby and Montifiore are pretty much the same building, but we rotate at Children's [also connected to Presby], the VA [general orthopaedics], Shadyside [Joints/tumor], St. Margarets [general orthopaedics], Southside [sports] and surgicenters [hand]. We do move around a bit, but it gives us a chance to see how both academic and private orthopaedic groups work. We have a large clinical faculty from private groups in the area. Lastly, post-call residents should be out the door the next morning -
hope it helps -

To all concerned, let me write as a previous attending at Pitt. I too was surprised at all of the mud slinging but I should say my piece to clarify some misconceptions. First, I will not remain anonymous in case there may be any misconceptions as noted previously. I am one of the trauma attendings who left not to long ago. I would probably not qualify for the accolades written about the one mentioned and they are probably speaking about the talented Prayson. I would like to comment on what I have read as I was informed about this from some residents. I have been on this site for a while and check it occassionally but recently there seems to be a flurry Pitt activity, so as a previous attending I thought it appropriate to comment.

While it is true that many of the faculty are leaving and that there are significant issues revolving around the insitution, and the region as well, the residency and its structure remain the same. The legacy of Pitt is very strong, and I remember when I applied for residency, a similar event was happening around the transition to J Herndons dynasty. As you can see, it recovered and did quite well. These are difficult times for many academic institutions and Pitt is no exception. While there may be a few notable gaps in "who" the teachers are, there is no gap in the pathology and I am sure all of you realize that residency education is 70% the individual (resident) and maybe 30% the place and teachers. You read, you operate, you practice. All you need is exposure. As a matter of fact, have hacks as negative examples is a good educational experience. So, as far as Pitt goes, the facts are true, the slander is not. What I can say that one of the few things I noticed as faculty is that there were a few very unhappy residents, not because of PITT but despite PITT. I think pittanswers response was a disservice and would postulate that mephisto is either one of the disgruntled residents (maybe pittsanwer themself) or someone who is posing as someone who worked there. This should not be a reflection of the remainder of the residents most of whom are superb residents and good people. In fact, I remain in touch with several and in my new position, they are one of the things I miss most. In closing, realizing the importance of anonymity in these postings, I will not come out with my name but it is easy to figure out from my posting name and the fact that I mentioned my previous position. For students considering Pitt, take a good look at it and don't worry about the likes of Pittanswer, they may be gone by the time you get there.

On last item, pittanswer whould be wary of their accusations and try to be the professional that they are supposed to be. I myself was a bit shocked by what I read but facts are more appropriate than emotional tirades and baseless accusations.

I am currently an intern at pitt, and couldn't be happier. All of the attendings mentioned that have left with the exeption of 1 I knew about before I matched. A similar flux was experienced by the current superchiefs(6th year residents {5 + 1yr research}) when they were 4th year medical students. I spoke with many of them before coming and they eased my worries. The 2 trauma attendings who have left were new when those superchiefs were interns. Both were very technically good, and went on to be chief of trauma at new depts. I rotated with ecurb as student and had great experience and as mentioned was well aware of movement of attendings. He was recently out of fellowship when hired and moved on in around 5-6 years to chief of of trauma dept elsewhere. I'm sure the cycle will cont. as above. I won't feel the flux as by my second year, new sports, hand and tumor docs will be entrenched in their position and to me it will seem like they have always been their. Young attendings move. This should not at all effect you students. I think only junior residents pgy3-4 feel the change b/c they work with both the attendings that are coming and the ones going. Pitt was a great choice for me. It is all I expected. I can tell you the rest of my intern class feels the same way. As for program director. I never worked with the prior, but new director has been wonderful, and our academic exposure thus far has been tremendous. I have friends that matched at all the majors, the harvard's, mayo's etc,. We speak often and I can tell you pitt can compare with the best of them. Find a program that fits what you want to get out of it academics,vs operative, vs. combo and rotate there. That way you have people to ask if you are concerned about things. I know that being able to call some of the residents I worked with made the difference for me. Bottom line pitt is fine, and I don't think any of us are worried. As a student now if you match here, I don't think you will even know there has been any flux at all. 80 hour work week is adhered to as asked earlier

Good luck with the match

hey guys
Haven't posted much on this site, and I am completely third party -
no stake in this post.

i know everyone's pretty stressed right now - including myself,
but i figure a lot of it is out of my hands at this point - so trying to relax.

Anyways - I rotated at Pitt in October on the sports service. Loved it.
Got some interaction with Dr. Fu - he is the most considerate chair I
have ever met. Even as a student; he took the time to approach me
several times to see how the rotation was going etc.

As far as attendings leaving - obviously that is true. Its probably a combination of $, politics and timing - like anything else in this world!
The new hand surgeon ran a few of the morning conferences - he is
awesome. The new sports attending - probably as good as any senior
attending I saw operate. They are still a very solid program - and I
have no doubt will stay that way.
Also, during one of the grand rounds, Dr. Fu made an announcement to everyone that he in fact was considering the UCSF job - but had since officially turned it down..I believe him - he has no reason to lie. If he was gunno leave anyways, he wouldn't care to much how his leaving effected the incoming applicant class.

Ok - now that I have said the +ve's I think I owe it to my fellow
applicants for other things I have heard - just to watch out for.
While I was on the interview trail, heard from a few good sources
that Dr. Fu was still "visiting" UCSF. Now, he travels a bunch - so
I don't know what this means - but take it as you will.
Ok - several nights on call - worked with the "supercheifs" in the OR.
They are AWESOME - I think its an asset, but I have to admit
a few of them made it clear that esp in the beginning of the year
its a TON of responsiblity. They have a lot of backup from attendings,
and I think it gets them ready for the real world. However, there
was talk that they may be getting rid of this year - who knows.

Being from a midwest city (not Pitt) - found pitt to be a cool city - cheap
living, and u can pretty much find whatever you like - good bars - nice
clubs - sports, etc.

Anyhow, have no idea where I will end up, got no feedback from any programs - probably not good..who knows. Gunno rank how I liked programs and leave the rest up to higher powers. Still workin on it..

Good luck everyone!

Peace.