ms3
Unregistered User
(4/26/00 9:35:18 pm)
Reply
AOA
I am going to be applying for an ortho residency spot here in a couple of months and I am right on the
borderline as to whether or not I get elected to AOA. How important is it to be AOA and how bad will it
hurt me if I do not get AOA?
Bob
Local user
(4/27/00 7:00:09 pm)
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Re: AOA
Being AOA is definetly going to help your application. Unfortunately, due to the number of applications
received by programs, they are forced to use things like AOA to weed down the applicant pool.
However, if you fall just short, DON'T WORRY. AOA is definetly not the only criteria. If you just miss,
then you still must have done well in school. And, if you did well on the boards, your still in good shape.
Programs really put a lot of emphasis on board scores.
Research will also help boost your application if you have some.
If you have any other questions (some good programs, interview questions/style, etc.) let me know, I
just finished the interview trail and will be starting my internship this July, so it's all still fresh in my mind.
BTW, the interview process sucks!!
Good Luck!
slk
Local user
(4/27/00 7:53:48 pm)
Reply
Re: AOA
Bob, what are interviews generally like? I've heard bits and pieces, like they're usually about 6 hours or
so. Is it a series of interviews with different attendings and a tour? Also, is there a month or day of the
week that most programs schedule interviews? Thanks..
Bob
Local user
(4/28/00 10:07:18 am)
Reply
Ortho Interviews
Ortho interviews a little different than most. Programs usually schedule about two interview dates only,
and often they conflict with another program; therefore, you have to make your decision on which
interview to go to before you know anything about the program. This is done by design so that only
those serious about a program will interview there. Some of the "less desirable" programs are often more
flexible and schedule more dates to attract more candidates. Often these programs are very good, but
don't have a "big name." Interview season starts in late October with Mayo and Case Western Reserve.
Than usually no program interviews in November. Then mid December through the end of January is
crazy - so make sure you either take thosae months off or have a very flexible schedule in these
months.
As for the interviews themselves, every program is different. On average, you will interview with four
different people in four different interview- no group interviews. However, this varies greatly. At U of
Chicago, you interview with ten (yes 10) different people over 3.5-4 hours. This is very exhausting. At
some of the smaller community programs, you may only interview with the chairman. At Northwestern,
you interview with about 10 people all at once while you're in the hot seat. So, as you can see, there is
great variety.
As for the interviews themselves, almost all are very laid back - just relax and be yourself. Typical
questions are
Why orthopaedics?
Tell me about yourself.
Where else have you interviewed?
What other programs did you like and why?
What are you looking for in a program?
If you did research, they will ask about that. KNOW YOUR RESEARCH WELL!!
I would suggest scheduling a couple of programs early in the interview season that you aren't really
interested in so that you can polish your interview skills and learn which questions will be asked. It seems
like all interviewers ask the same questions. By the time you're done interviewing, you can spit out your
answers before they even ask them!
Hope this helps. If you have any other specific questions - fire away!!!
ZachO
Global user
(5/3/00 10:48:26 pm)
Reply
Interviewing experience....
Bob, What can you tell me about the other Chicago programs, Loyola in particular???? Also did you
interview at any programs in New England???
Bob
Local user
(5/4/00 11:19:58 am)
Reply
Re: Interviewing experience ZachO
If you were to ask most people to rank the Chicago programs they would probably rank them as follows:
1. Rush
2. Northwestern
3. U of Chicago
4. Loyola
5. U of Illinois Chicago
Although, some people might swap 1. and 2.
Unfortunately, I did not apply to Loyola. On the interview circuit, however, I did meet a few people who
did interview there (you will see the same people everywhere you go). The two people who did interview
at Loyola really liked the program a lot. I guess it's not in the city itself, and that was one aspect that
they liked. But, they did like the program as a whole. I can't give you much more info than that,
however. My suggestion is to find out as much as you can by asking around and searching the net. If
the program sounds like something you'd like, apply and see what happens.
I interviewed mostly in the midwest because that's where I wanted to stay. I did interview at Johns
Hopkins, which I did like very much. HSS offered me an interview, but their interview style turned me off,
so I declined. Although, I'm told they treat their residents well. I have a friend who matched at Thomas
Jefferson. He liked the program a lot during the interview. I know TJ isn't technically New England, but it's
out East. If you have specific programs you're interested in, I may have some insight if you name them.
ZachO
Global user
(5/5/00 12:52:28 pm)
Reply
Specific programs
Any info on Brown, UVM, or UConn?????? I've heard Yale's program is excellent in regard to research,
but poor in regard to operative experience. Also, where did you end up matching(if you don't mind me
asking.....
Bob
Local user
(5/6/00 7:49:10 pm)
Reply
Re: Specific programs
I don't know any specifics, but I did talk to a few people who went to interview at UVM and Brown. The
people who went to UVM loved the program. Also, the people who went to Brown seemed to like the
program pretty well. I don't know anything about UConn.
Sorry, I couldn't be more specific, but like I said, I tended to stay in the Midwest. So, if you plan to
interview there at all, I could probably give you more info!!
BTW, I ended up matching at the Cleveland Clinic.
Unregistered User
(5/7/00 6:51:21 am)
Reply
Obtaining AOA
I looking into ortho as a possible career down the road and was wondering if anyone could help me out
with the topic of AOA. What is it, how can I find out more about it, how do you get it?? Any info would
be greatly appreciated!!
Kent
Unregistered User
(5/7/00 2:54:56 pm)
Reply
What's AOA...
AOA is the national honorary society for medical students. Even though it's national, not every school will
have a chapter. You can be elected in your junior year (and this is usually limited to the top 5% or so of
the class), but more people are elected in the early senior year (and this is usually limited to about 15%
of the total class). At my school, selection was based purely on a numerical score composed of first-year
honors grades (my second year was pass/fail), honors in third-year required rotations, and Step I
scores. Since it's a national thing (but not all schools have it), it has become an unfortunate screening
tool for orthopaedics (along with Step I scores). We had lots of good, hard-working people who were
AOA, but it really seemed that the majority of our junior AOA people were notorious for ass-kissing and
general sucking-up. Some people mastered the art of doing very little on the third-year required
rotations, but making it look and sound like they were super students when the attending was around
(these rotations carried lots of weight for AOA selection). My advice? Work hard on EVERY rotation, do
your best on every test/boards exam, and do the best job if simply because you're a medical student
and that's what you're supposed to do. It's a skill that will take you far regardless of AOA status. Too
many people won't lift a finger unless there's some immediate reward for them (like getting into AOA). If
you don't make it into AOA, all is not lost concerning orthopaedics. If you've got a strong record and
interview well, then it's all about "fit". Many non-AOA people are outstanding orthopaedic residents (and
who generally work very hard "just because"). When you get to your third- and fourth-year rotations
and residency, you'll encounter some of those supposed junior AOA stars that nobody can stand or
wants to work with. Try your hardest to get into AOA (see if you can find out how your particular school
elects members), but don't be a sell-out.
Bone44
Global user
(5/7/00 4:32:43 pm)
Reply
Thank you!!
Kent,
Thanks for your reply and info--it is a great help!!
CS
Local user
(5/9/00 4:34:17 pm)
Reply
Re: Specific programs
Re: U Conn (but second hand info)
One of the guys at my med school matched there and he thinks it's great b/c you get a lot of operative
expereince including trauma plus good sports med and it's non-malignant. He thought it was better than
Yale by far in terms of training.
NE boy
Unregistered User
(7/22/00 5:32:23 pm)
Reply
AOA
I think Yale's short-coming has been the fact it was not a trauma center. It now is and are getting a
ortho trauma chief. It may not be the best program but UConn is not in the same league.
Brown and Yale are comparable.
zach0
Unregistered User
(8/30/00 9:17:44 pm)
Reply
Yale, huh????
I had recently heard that many of Yale's bigger name Orthopods resigned because Yale/New Haven
announced an across the board 10% pay cut in the department.........I imagine this will significantly affect
the program.
Anyone know anything about this?????
How bout you NE boy? You seem to be pretty keen on Yale.
ColoradoMSI
Registered User
Posts: 1
(2/18/01 1:41:22 pm)
Reply
Re: AOA
i am an ms-I, who didn't honor any courses in the first quarter.
all hope lost for ortho?? i've heard that aoa is alreay out of the questions, true?
thanks for any advice.
orthosurg1
Registered User
Posts: 4
(2/18/01 6:15:10 pm)
Reply
AOA STATUS
Once again, we near the end of one ortho residency session, and the questions from the future ortho
residency applicants now begins. I am personally nearing the end of the residency selection process, so I
guess I have a little knowledge on what I found. I think that your hopes are not all lost, but I don't know
how AOA works at Colorado. I would suggest that you pick up the pace a little. I also know that while
AOA status helped my application and allowed me to obtain some interviews that I would not have got
otherwise, it was not everything. I would suggest, like all of my predecessors have before me, that you
get some research under your belt, work hard to obtain good grades, study hard for step I, and get to
know the attendings at your school. I personally know that the Colorado Ortho program has some
attendings that would be glad to get you started. OH yeah, one more think, relax a little, OK.
pikeortho
Registered User
Posts: 2
(2/18/01 8:56:20 pm)
Reply
aoa
Just because you didn't honor any of your first semester classes doesn't mean you won't get AOA, just
try to pick it up a little, you still have lots of classes to go. I have just finished interviewing for ortho and
I do think that being AOA got me some of my interviews and the topic did usually come up during the
interviews. However, being AOA is definitely not the most important thing, a strong step I score is much
more important and doing research is almost just as important. So don't panic, relax and do the best
you can, start on some research early and do good on Step I and you will get into ortho. Good Luck.
OneRunner
Registered User
Posts: 9
(2/19/01 11:39:37 am)
Reply
AOA
I would agree with the above. Personally, I did not make honors in any class for the entire first semester,
but really picked it up and made AOA by doing well later, especially in the third year. This being said, I
know others who truly deserved AOA, but did not get it and it was barely noticeable on their
applications. I believe the things that stood out most on my application (and the things that residencies
look for) were board scores, 3rd year grades and extracurricular activities. if you have the time, definitely
get involved doing a couple of different things. Ortho is not a specialty that is looking for
one-dimensional, grades-at-any-cost personalities. Residency programs want variety and they can
command it from those who they will accept. Do not fret about a slow start, afterall the tortoise beat the
hare.
Techno
Registered User
Posts: 7
(2/22/01 6:49:42 am)
Reply
Yale
From what I remember, there was a 10% pay cut in the department which caused a lot of faculty to
leave. If my notes are right, one hand surgeon, one spine surgeon, and two sports surgeons left last
year. The residents seemed very friendly, however, and the faculty appeared very warm and
approachable. Resident camaraderie is a big bonus here. This looks like a great program, despite the fact
that it's in its rebuilding phase. Research still appears to be strong here, and they apparently have good
operative experience (i.e. plenty of cases to do).
I did not interview at UConn or Brown, but I hear both are great programs. UConn has a heavy operative
case-load, with its residents doing a lot of cases as first assistant as early as their second year.
