I rotated at Penn and loved it, but didn't go back for the interview because my wife and I didn't like the town and I had a conflict. The residents all seemed very happy, very good lifestyle, plenty of research opportunity, good operative experience, all subspecialties covered. If you like philly then I highly recommend Penn.

Penn -- very friendly faculty and residents...but operative experience MAY not be as great as other more clinical programs. Fair amount of research. It's a rather cush program. As far as ortho, it's a fine place to train but I think much of its rep comes from the name of the instution rather than the quality of the training they offer.

Jeff -- first 2 years is brutal. Legend has it you get in at 4 am your 2nd year and leave late. Very busy program -- it's like a factory -- upwards of 30 joints PER DAY. Training gets easier as the years progress, and as a chief you come in to operate and leave afterwards. So it gets better. Very reputable program and they turn out quality surgeons...you'll experience a lot of pain though your first couple years.

I'm in school in Philly and I agree with Micky.

Penn - Cush with good research, but not as much OR time. Rotate with individual attendings instead of being on various services. Has good and bad. Not as much scut as other places because everything is divided up. As above, the name of the program will take you much further than the actual training.

Jeff - Doesn't get much worse than the PGY2, but very sweet after that. AWESOME affiliate rotations at some community places, Dupont for Peds, Lehigh for Trauma. You go almost half of the third year with NO CALL. The Big House though, is a JOINT FACTORY and you're a cog in the wheel.

Temple - Haven't been there, but heard they're hurting for attendings and the residents spend much of the day waiting for Trauma. Most of the elective stuff in Philly goes to Jeff or Penn. Very cool Chairman though.

Hahnemann - Supposedly on the rebound with a big-gun Chairman, but still hurting for attendings (they just lost Dr. Lazarus, the big shoulder guy to Jeff.)

Einstein - Very cool, small program with a young faculty. Lots of OR experience, but you have to deal with supposedly inflated ego of the Chairman.

Overall, I'd place Jeff and Penn a step above the others. I'd actually say you getter much better clinical training at Jeff than Penn, despite the bias of a lot of old posts here.

agree with dr. sawbonz that mcp-hahnemann is definitely hurting for attendings... the place is emptying fast (lazarus, Israelite and Bosaco all gone or retired). But Johanson is certainly a big-gun chairman and will likely turn the place around...question is WHEN.

A classmate of mine rotated at Temple - he liked the residents but disliked the chairman, who apparently gave every student the cold shoulder and was real full of himself. They seemingly get pretty decent trauma experience but elective cases are more scarce. They apparently get their elective stuff at a community hospital where there are not many (or any) fellowship trained surgeons. How significant that is I'm not sure.

Don't know anything about Einstein.

Bottom line on philly programs -- you get best training at Jeff, Penn has biggest name (because of its Ivy League undergrad and top med school status AND NOT FOR ITS ORTHO DEPARTMENT in my opinion)...the rest fall in the same boat and you get good training at all 3 just like anywhere else...MCP-Hahnemann is an enigma (big chair but uncertain future), Temple is in-bred and Einstein is a good community program.