Info about New York Programs

Here are the top programs in New York (only one person's opinion)
1) HSS
2) Columbia
3) NYU/HJD
4) Mount Sinai
5) Lenox
6) LIJ
7) Stonybrook

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Downstate

Cannot go wrong with the top 3 and certainly the city makes it a harder place to match.

I was wondering not only which programs are the "best"--probably meaning the most prestigious--but which provide the best, non-mailignant training. I know that some east coast programs pride themselves on their malignant heritage...Duke for example. That is great for them, but I do not want to train at those programs. Any ideas along those lines in NYC?

I would seriously consider looking at Mt. Sinai if you are interested in a non-malignant program with a good operative experience. They operate like mad starting as PGY-2s. In fact, I think there are more operating rooms running than there are residents each day. They have PAs and nurses to help take the load off the floor work (discharges, etc). The attendings are all approachable and laid back. 7AM conference each day seems nice (not 6AM like some places).

No matter what program you are looking at, take note of how many operating rooms are going each day. If there are 2 residents in a room on all cases, that most likely means you won't be operating until later on (PGY-4+). If you are single scrubbed with an attending, you will learn and do more. And obviously look at the residents. If you are with laid back, nice residents, your training will go a lot better, and any program will seem more benign.

By the way, in the rankings above I would put Sinai ahead of Columbia hands down. You aren't going to go wrong with any program in NYC, because let's face it, it's NYC. But for all the reasons stated above I think Sinai is the better training program. Columbia is an awesome place, I just don't think it's better than Sinai.

I don't know if you're set on going to NYC bud but there are a lot of places that have a situation that would facilitate a couples match. It all depends, of course, on what your significant other would want to go into but Northeast Ohio has a number of different institutions that are popular with couples matching. We have three residents in our program right now who couples matched and only one of their spouses is in a program at our institution. The Northeast Ohio region has a number of prestigious places to train in a variety of specialties: Cleveland Clinic, University Hospitals/Case Western Reserve, Akron General Medical Center/Northeastern Ohio Univs, SUMMA Health System/Northeastern Ohio Univs, Children's Hospital Medical Center of Akron/Northeastern Ohio Univs and Rainbow Babies/Case Western juts to name a few. This is by no means an exhaustive list as there are also community FP, IM, Radiology and OB residencies at Aultman Hospital in Canton which is also in the region. So, depending on what you guys are looking for, there are definitely other options outside of NYC for a small area with lots of excellent training and less malginant residencies.

Lennox Hill is a solid program but may not be a good idea for couples matching because residents spend lots of time at away institutions...I remember at least 3 months trauma in Dallas and 6 months in Boston for peds...I think there was another away rotation but I don't recall. At least that's how it was 4 years ago.

as above poster pointed out, consider other cities. All large cities have numerous training programs. Like Chicago, philadelphia. Maryland is also a possibility as it is close to programs in DC. NE Ohio certainly has a number of training programs. Midwestern cities are generally isolated. The East coast, especially from northern Virginia to NY is packed with university and training programs. Philadelphia is a very good option for couples matching. It's more affordable than NY as well.

I couples matched last year -- we ended at our 1st pairing (I'm at LIJ, she's at NYMC). LIJ in particular was very accomodating, and made phone calls to her program to help facilitate things. It's a great program, heavy on the operating starting PGY-II, great attendings, great ancillary staff, great facility. You should definitely look into it.

We also looked at some of the other programs listed above. We found the Cleveland/Akron area very accomodating as well, and were particularly impressed with Case/Rainbow as a complex. A really nice hospital, great facilities, and a great program. It almost lured us away from NYC.

Other places that appeared to be couples-friendly were Rochester, Miami, and Einstein/Montefiore. But, the advantage to NYC, Cleveland, Boston, or Chicago are that there are a number of strong programs in all fields in a close geographical area -- easy to find a good compromise for both of you.

I'd also add to the list of NYC programs:

NYMC
Einstein/Montefiore
St Luke's-Roosevelt

You could also include UMDNJ/Newark (actually much closer than Stony Brook even).

I'm not sure that I'd totally agree with the ranking order listed in the previous post, but overall most of the programs are very strong. To each his own. You'll see which program suits your style best.

I am adding Albany to the list also, this program is a hidden gem in upstate NY. Tons of operative exp, awesome residents and would likely be a place you could couples match into.

I couple's matched into Columbia with my fiancee a ped's resident at Columbia as well (our No. 1 choice). Couldn't be happier so far. PM is you have any specific questions. if you are serious about coming to NYC, I'd recommend doing an away rotation at one of the programs here to really decide if NYC if for you (I love it, but not everyone does, it is probably a big change from Utah).

Irondoc,
Is Columbia big on rotators?

of my year, 3 were rotators, 3 were not. so you can definitely match here without rotating. i was not a rotator, but did rotate in NYC.

While programs may favor rotators during the match, rotating does not guarantee you an interview at all programs. Columbia is an example of one that does not. I rotated there, and while I was given an interview, there were 2 (out of 7) who rotated the same month as I and they were not interviewed.

In talking with them on the interview trail at other programs, they were upset that they didn't get an interview. But I think they realized it really is for the best. If Dr. Levine (Columbia residency director) feels that even with the rotation you most likely won't be ranked there, he's really doing you a favor by not wasting one of your interview days. January gets really busy, and there are lots of weekends with 3 or more programs interviewing on one given day. So you have to make a choice as to which interview to go to. Courtesy interviews could potentially screw up your match, because you could have rejected an interview at a place where you had a chance.

In response to the question about couples matching, I couples-matched into the Einstein-Montefiore program with my wife at OB/GYN at St.-Luke's-Roosevelt. So far the experience has been even better than I expected. I would definitely put our program among the better ones in the city, seeing the experience as a whole and where residents from this program end up when they're done.

The overall operative experience at this program is outstanding, and there's a great balance of sports, trauma, spine, joints, and hand. You also get great tumor experience with one of our best attendings. Wednesday mornings till noon are protected for grand rounds and lectures, and every Monday there's a Chief of Service journal article review led by an attending in the given field. As far as social activities, there's weekly pick-up basketball, and a city-league team that one of our attendings pays for.

In the end, the bottom line is that residents from this program get great fellowships. Two of this past year's chiefs, for example, are now at Harvard, one doing joints @ Brigham, and one doing tumor at MGH. Several recent graduates have also done fellowships at Starr Hand Center at St-Luke's-Roosevelt.

As far as living, more than half of the residents live in Manhattan. I commute from Manhattan to the Bronx, which is a breeze, and the intern year so far has been a great mix of challenging/fun/easy rotations (Ortho trauma intern 2months, radiology, plastics, and ER). Good luck as you all trudge through the next couple of months.

Someone recently posted a fairly negative review of NYU-HJD on Scutwork.com



I wonder if anyone has first-hand knowledge whether any of those allegations (folding resident's scrubs!? and poor camraderie) are true.

Another great program in NY is Rochester.
A lot of the residents are married or have a SO who they couples matched with at their program. Have to deal with the long winters but great some great micro-brew, BBQ, and finger lake wine.

BobAEPi,

Being a resident at HJD, I find that post on scutwork.com to be completely off target. It seems to be written by someone who has not even rotated at our institution since many of the statements are completely false. For example the person stated we made students deliver us clean scrubs?! - in fact we have individual scrub lockers at HJD where clean scrubs are delivered to us by the laundry service. So I don't understand that post?

I truly believe matching at HJD was the best thing that ever happened to me professionally. HJD is one of the most well rounded programs in the country. The residents get along EXTREMELY well with eachother and with the attending staff. Our training is fantastic and graduates feel very competent at the end of the residency. The program is academic, and therefore there is an adequate amount of didactic teaching with our Wed grand rounds, and 1-2 service conferences per week.

If anyone has any questions I would be happy to answer any further questions.

I should add that Montefiore/Einstein is a very family friendly place, in the event that you are planning on expanding yours during the next 5 years.

Just a thought from another Utahn who has been at Einstein for a while now...